SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Don't forget it's all my fault though. He honestly, genuinely believes he's a good person. Last time, he kept telling me over and over that he was a good man.

This morning, he seems to be ignoring me. And I think what got to him was when I said I don't like him. Not all the other ranting about what he's done. He's wounded that I don't like him.

One other gem was when I said he'd reverted back last time to not helping me with anything in the house etc he turned that right round to, "Well you didn't tell me, you didn't help me to help you." He turns 50 next year. Any of you single ladies out there better watch out!

You didn’t tell him? SMH. Like he’s a 12-year-old who needs to be reminded he has chores instead of an adult partner with equal share in the practical work and responsibilities of life.

I’m sorry he’s putting you through this again. I admire your strength and how collected you are.

Update from me - I am away this week with my parents and children. Husband was meant to come but had to invent an excuse of being too busy with work because I can't have him here with my parents etc.

I was 100% holding the line on the divorce. I asked why he hadn't filled in his half if it and he said he was having trouble logging in so we did it while I was there and so the first part of that is done and submitted. I am a bit confused what to do next - whether I need a solicitor or mediator to help with the pensions etc. I think the financial reality is hitting him now as well, he was in some sort of dream world where we'd all have enough money to carry on living as we are.

Then on Friday night, we were all coming away the following morning so he obviously started to feel it as he was being left at home. At about 5.30 in the morning he wanted to talk if I was awake (I was). He wanted to know if I though the marriage really was beyond repair. He said he will do anything including any of the housework and give me access to everything (devices etc). He said he will give up all his choirs and he won't stay away with work overnight, he'll make sure he comes home. My side of this deal however was that I have to show him affection and basically have sex twice a week (!). There was a lot of "But we were happy once!" and so on.

Now, the self-pitying mess he has got himself into did sway me a bit. It is hard to see someone distraught and he is worrying about himself and also telling the kids. It did make me think, and it did make me wonder if there was any other way out of this mess.

But then I have come away on Saturday and I think I need to carry on with the divorce. I think he'd change for a year or two and then settle back. It isn't realistic for me to have ongoing access and be checking things all the time, and it isn't realistic for him to basically give up going anywhere ever again. So the cheating opportunities would soon come round again. Hmmm. And the 'lack of affection' is because he is literally never here. I keep everything running. He didn't change anything from the first time once he'd got comfortable. I have told him that the onus should have been on him to make me feel safe and to recognise that giving lifts to females etc etc shouldn't be happening any more after the first time.

Added to this, I still don't know who the other person is! He has not volunteered that information.

I think he is definitely feeling it now but some of what he was saying was actually self pity rather than a real willingness to change. He cheated (twice!) and the default position should have been to expect a divorce but that doesn't seem to have registered with him. He is like a child in some ways.

So I think I have to hold the line and keep going forward with the divorce. But it is going to be hard because he has dropped the 'I want out too' act. He is going to get into an emotional mess. And telling the children will be even harder because of it, I don't want to be the bad guy. Also I do care about him to the extent of I don't want to drive him to a breakdown or anything like that....I don't want him to get into such a state he loses his job or anything either. His job is stressful and busy so he doesn't need this on top really, even though he's done it himself.

So that's my update - two weeks of me being firm and he started to crack. But that's not necessarily what I want, I want it all done I think.

My side of this deal however was that I have to show him affection and basically have sex twice a week (!)

I don’t think he’s in a position to make demands. That doesn’t mean that he needs to live in a marriage lacking affection and sex for the rest of his life, it means that he doesn’t seem to understand that to get those, a spouse needs to be present and invested in the marriage, which he isn’t seeing that his solution is to cheat. You don’t demand these things, you invest in your marriage and most of the times affection and sex follows. And if those don’t follow you discuss further and ultimately divorce, not give yourself permission to cheat.

I also want to highlight that reconciliation is a long process and doesn’t involve just sharing your passwords and giving up some activities and overnight trips. You’re not his warden and becoming one would be exhausting. What he’s saying is "I’ll give you the right and potentially the means for you to prevent me to cheat again but it is in your power to do so". Ie. he is still making this somehow your responsibility, if you have sex twice a week, offer him affection (even if undeserving) and monitor his devices and whereabouts he may remain faithful. 😳

This isn’t what reconciling means, at least not for me. Yes, sharing passwords, location, etc is a start but true reconciliation requires the WS to attend therapy and understand what is broken within them and with their moral values, if they believe that each time they experience some hardship in a relationship they are entitled to cheat rather than work at fixing whatever they believe is not working.

It means years of investing in the marriage, facing all their "ugly" such as conflict avoidance, ego stroking seeking, passive aggressiveness and so on.

Do you think he may be capable of that?

ETA: you could find out who ow is by saying you’re willing to consider his proposal only after he discloses her identity.

[This message edited by Luna10 at 12:45 PM, Tuesday, April 11th]

You are right. I was confused when I was in the situation but having come away for a few days I can see that it wasn't remorse (I don't think he even ever said sorry at any point) but self-pity.

I don't think I have it in me to reconcile and he definitely doesn't. I didn't get over it properly the first time and he did the bare minimum - he did answer my questions and give me access etc. We went to marriage counselling which was a pile of nonsense. I read lots. He didn't. he read short articles I sent to him and that was it. I told him to go to IC and he never did. His focus was on making a 'good' marriage with things that might have worked without the cheating but he never fully recognised the damage he'd done with the cheating and that we were effective starting with a negative balance then.

Another thing is that by staying, it's me that gets to suffer again. He would sigh with relief and the kids would be none the wiser - and I'd be twisting myself round in knots again and struggling with everything.

So my answer is still no. I need to really keep focused on the long term and making my life better in 5 years, 10 years....and honestly I think divorce is the only way to achieve that. I don't want to make him suffer unnecessarily and the last thing I want is for him to end up a broken mess. He's going to have to find some resolve as well to pull himself out of this rut and move on.

Another thing is that by staying, it's me that gets to suffer again. He would sigh with relief and the kids would be none the wiser - and I'd be twisting myself round in knots again and struggling with everything.

If he couldn’t realise the work he needed to do the first time around when he saw you barely functioning, instead he decided to cheat again, there is very little left there. I’m not saying it is impossible, I’m saying that personally I’d like to see more than a peace offering where he is stating HIS demands in order to keep it in his pants.

To add as well, I’m really sorry this happened to you again, I am amazed though at your resilience and the way you jumped into action. My plan B (if I were to find another A) is reacting exactly like you did and you are just showing me it is possible, whilst I’m in no doubt it isn’t easy. I was like you the first time, I thought I’d die, lost over 2st in a month, couldn’t sleep, I was constantly shaking and had panic attacks, I felt suicidal and even lost my job a year later.

I cannot afford that again and you’re giving me the strength I need to know I will be fine if there is going to be a next time.

I need to really keep focused on the long term and making my life better in 5 years, 10 years....

I love this, Debra! I know we hear it so often, "what's your 5-year plan?", that it almost seems like a throwaway, but when you spend a little time with it, it's a really a very insightful observation.

In terms of the kids finding out, yeah.. as parents we'd all like to provide nothing but happy childhood memories. But the reality is that that's not our job. Our job is to prepare them to function as adults in a world that's not always kind. Infidelity can be a teaching opportunity for a host of lessons.. grace under fire, actions have consequences, boundaries are good things, be honest, it's okay to limit toxic people, etc. We model life for them... and life isn't always a big bowl of cherries.

Have faith in yourself. If it helps any, I think your instincts are going to serve you well. You're a compassionate person, but also smart enough to see that giving people their own way isn't always the best thing.

((hugs))

You are a kind and caring person. I value your kindness. AND…

Just because you have resolve and go through divorce doesn’t equate with not caring about your WH…not the same at all.

You can find it sad to see him struggle through this, yet keep your resolve to better your life and that of your kids.

It’s easy to vilify COMPLETELY a WH. But ultimately, even though it is hard, everybody wins in the end if things are less negative. Less negativity when interaction is necessary. Less negative effect on the kids. Just don’t mistake your empathy for his possible suffering for a reason to consider staying.

I think you are absolutely on the right road.

Best of luck!!!

Too many people make excuses for their cheating. They are never right. Cheating is constant lying, sneaking and giving themselves emotionally and physically to another. There is no excuse.

So the person you described never got out of childhood emotionally. Who knows why. If he had the ability to grow up he would have done it after the first time. From what I am reading you have been his parent, the police to keep an eye on his activities and the only adult in the house. It is so tiring.

Divorce might make him sad but it frees you up to enjoy life without a millstone around your neck.
If a miracle should occur and he makes it into adulthood it will be a surprise. The life he has led up to now gave him all the jollies he wanted….and you come and dump reality on his parade. You reap what you sow and he has weeds.

Take care of yourself.

Someone on here asked if anyone regretted their divorce. All the respondents said NO.

Thank you all, I know I am doing the right thing but that there will be some wobbles along the way. I honestly think I will end up happier, I hope the kids will be eventually as well. We will get there in the end, it might be a bit painful for a few months yet though.

I tell you what I won't miss. We are at the coast this week and I texted him yesterday to say 'remember to put the bins out'. he replied saying it's just the recycling collection this week and there isn't much. No - it was the general waste collection. I know this because I can see it on the internet and I printed the schedule and stuck it on the fridge. So yes - it is really like having another child.

Just don’t mistake your empathy for his possible suffering for a reason to consider staying.

Stayed for the boys after affair no1. Stayed to get the house fixed after affair no2. Then in Aug 2022, he found a lump in his neck which was cancer. I didn’t shed a tear. Not once. But I was angry all over again – it was the just punishment of the gods. Throat cancer caused by a sexually transmitted disease, HPV. I wanted to scream in his face loud enough to burst his eardrums. It would have been from years/decades ago, but knowing it was basically an STD was enough to rile me. Cancer is not something I would ever have wished for on him. He’s had the treatment, mostly without much complaint, the prognosis is good. It has been extremely brutal with daily radiotherapy pinned to a table by a nightmarish mask. He is still suffering the after effects. He hopes to get the all clear next week, but even then he still has some months to go in recovery and years before he is regarded as "cured".

I have said that my role is to get him back to full health so he can find another partner and to get the house finished so we can sell it. We can retire the business and take the money (not a lot, but enough as a lump sum to each buy a car or something) and sort the pension (there’s only one, I don’t have one) and then go our separate ways apart from when we travel out to see DS1&2 (Australia and NZ citizens) when I want us to go together because it’s easier all round. He doesn’t want any of what is to come, but like so many others, I’m not prepared to stay just to be done over again. I like him and we get on, so we are house mates. I just don’t like him enough to stay and I don’t care about him enough to want to make the effort. I’m 65 and want more than he is able or capable of offering.

And yes, my WH sounds the same - he "went to work and UKg does everything else" - including the bin calendar.

I have been following your story and so much resonates with me. I stayed for my kids the first time, thought we had reconciled. The only effort he made then was STD testing and months of trickle truth..

I suspected this last summer but I waited, watched but was still destroyed when I confronted. I have been cold, noncommittal for the future and many days I just don’t see the point. He will just betray me again.

He is in IC but I haven’t committed to MC yet. I have told him he needs to tell our grown kids and his sister. I think he is just waiting me out. I can see how afraid he is this time because I am not crying or emotional.

You are resilient and you should feel proud that you are prioritizing you. I am still sitting on the fence and strangely detached and hopeful at the same time. I wish I were as brave as you. I wish I didn’t feel such shame in myself.

@UK Girl - Thank you for sharing - this is one of the things I am afraid of if I stay longer. I really don't want him to get ill or have an accident because I absolutely don't want to have to look after him in that situation or, worse, end up as his carer or something. I totally understand why you are annoyed, I would be too. Well done for making a plan to get out of it soon.

@Sick2Death - there is no shame in staying, you need to do what's best for you. And staying now doesn't mean you can't leave later. I think either road is hard. I just know neither of us are reconciliation material, I am good at harbouring a grudge and he just won't bother beyond giving me his passwords so I give up now. If you're like me, I did feel uncomfortable and a bit ashamed / disappointed in myself for staying the first time, I think because it didn't fit with my core values or what I truly believed. In reality, I do think that divorce should be the default if someone cheats on you - and yet I didn't do that. So there was a hard task of reconciling that with myself (and I have found the last 8 years hard because of it - there have been time when I have found myself drinking too much or spending too much on things to make me feel better, for example). Then perhaps some of the 'shame' in staying comes from what you think other people think - and you have to let that go because most of them don't actually care beyond having something to gossip about for a week, then it's forgotten. Sorry - that was a long way of saying that you shouldn't feel shame, you can play a longer game of waiting to see how it plays out. I bet he is worried that you are more detached this time. Mine was.

Keep moving forward, you’ve got this and whatever happens, don’t stop the divorce process! Unfortunately like yourself I’ve experienced a lot of the same things and thoughts over time and now ready to pull the plug - it’s not easy and the dynamics can change very quickly so be on guard.

Definition of insanity - Doing the same thing again and again but expecting a different outcome!!

I’d get some independent legal advice, by yourself for yourself. A lot of legal firms offer a free half or an hour - make sure you go in with all your details plus your husbands details to save time and have questions so you can maximise the advice! Don’t forget you could do this a few times with different firms if needed - take the advice you need and leave the rest!!

'it's just sex' is a cheater line. It's minimizing and they hope that your emotional person will come over the physical one though to many of us, the physical is worse.

But even if physical isn't worse to someone, to go after another sexually partner is a mental thought and desire. The fact you are going to be hurting the most important person in your life takes mental action before they decide or they simply don't care about you.

It is obvious that you took him back once. This obligation is no longer on you.

He obviously doesn't take his vows to you or his ethics into how he proceeds with this life.

You have figured out an exit plan in divorce. Now stop engaging him, let the attorneys talk and gain the distance you need to heal. He's blown it again if you haven't already tried, get away if legally possible and let the divorce process occur. He's setting you up for future failure. You deserve someone who is loyal to you. He's not the guy

I am sorry to read this DV. I really want to believe in reconciliation success stories.

Telling the kids makes it real. I am sorry you have to do this. This part was really hard for my ex. He too blamed me, but when the kids saw him as the bad guy it really struck home. And he felt sorry for himself.

Do what is right for you. Be as cold as you want, seriously what does he expect?

I got back from my break on Saturday. By the looks of things, WH had had his mummy feeding him while I was away.

I have contacted a solicitor and I have started pulling out paperwork to do with our pensions etc ready.

I thoroughly regret feeling sorry for him last week when he was feeling sorry for himself. He is being okay about sorting finances etc but he is so lacking in awareness of the impact of his actions. He again thought he could buy me out of the house and him stay here but he'd got the numbers all wrong and now realises (after I set him straight) that he can't do that. We do need to sell.

He's stopped talking about fixing the marriage again but he's back on the 'are you sure we can't stay in the same house and co parent?' and 'we could still all get together for Christmas and things like that'. No. We really can't.

In his little brain, we are friends. And I can cook and make idle chit chat over the dinner table while he carries on with his women.

He is going to London tomorrow and then Brussels the next day. So he isn't coming home - he's going to stay in London tomorrow and go from there. It's obvious what he's doing. And I am supposed to be totally alright with that because we're splitting up. It's a total lack of respect and tone deaf. I honestly hate him at this point. I hope he sees the faces of his crying children while he's having sex.

He's cost me thousands in lost income with his philandering and now he's spending our money on hotels and wining and dining women.

He also now wants 50:50 custody. I have pointed out that I have done the bulk of the childcare up to now and he doesn't have a clue about what the children need on which days etc. He says if he has to do it, he will. He won't manage. He has left me on my own with them night after night since they were born, and now they're easy to look after he wants them.

That's all really, he's an arse and I need to keep reminding myself of that fact.

[This message edited by DebraVation at 8:36 PM, Tuesday, April 18th]

The man who can’t feed himself and calls his elderly mum to feed him wants 50/50 custody 🤣.

He is probably looking for ways to reduce child support.

You know… I never truly witnessed an amiable divorce. It may happen in movies but to my experience, one of the spouses, usually the guilty part, turns horrible and starts intimidating and bullying the other.

I hope it won’t get worse for you as he realises, slowly, the impact of his actions.