SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Had a major drama with FWH. We are in real estate. OW's parents are selling their home. FWH asked if I'd have a problem if we bought it....not to live in....but to develop the property. It's a deal. OW's parents know us. Know the whole story, as OBS outted it to them.

Now...FWH didn't hide that it the property came up on his radar. Didn't hide that he knew who owned it. And asked what I thought about it. Those are all new behaviors. During and pre-A....he wouldn't have consulted me. We have made some progress. I didn't answer him at first. I was just trying to process it. He did it at the end of a beautifully romantic dinner we were having. It was kind of like the record needle dramatically scratching. He had forgotten that he and OW and said parents made our family Christmas dinner during the A. My family of origin is complicated to say the least, and FWH and OW sold it as providing a family Christmas when I didn't have one. Little did I know that this was their way of getting to spend the holiday together.... Conveniently,he didn't initially recall that. The idea came from a builder partner of ours. FWH told said partner that he knew the owners and that I might not like the idea (ya think?) because he used to workout with their daughter and then said....."nothing happened". This he told me.

I get that he didn't want to out himself to the builder friend. It's been nearly 5 years. But, I lost it. Seriously, considering the property....given that this is my business....I can excuse, I had to take a moment to think about how it might benefit us long term....and it would. But, the "nothing happened" BS just took me back to trigger hell. 1. He said this all the time during the affair. 2. He threw me under the bus, made me out to be the unreasonably jealous wife.
When he saw my reaction, he took the whole idea off the table with the builder and said I wouldn't be happy, because of mistakes he had made regarding OW. Or at least that is what he told me. Do I believe that 100%, hell no. I told him this lying is "affair" behavior and I won't be around for it.

I'm trying to look at what he did do that was different. And those are positive, I guess. But, that I had to tell me what to do at all, makes me think that I'll never get away from this. That he's not fundamentally changed. To be honest, things have been really pretty good with us for a long while. But, this one had me really wondering if this hard work was worth it at all.

I'd be pissed that he brought it up at the end of a romantic dinner. That's something you talk about during business hours, if you will, not over candlelight and creme brulee. Especially since it's so obviously loaded.

I told him this lying is "affair" behavior and I won't be around for it.

Do you mean the initial "nothing happened" lie to the builder, or the lie to you that he later told the builder the truth? Or both?

I think I'd tell my H that it'd be wise to never utter those words around me ever again.

I read what you posted a couple of times just so I was clear, but the general message is that your WH and a builder friend had identified a property that he (builder) thought would be a great opportunity for your business. In the process of your WH and the builder discussing the details, he made mention that he knew the owners (AP parents) and that you might not be down with it and of course when his friend, quite logically, asked, why would your wife not be good with it? He quickly dodged it with a "nothing happened."

Might I add a slightly different perspective, just for thought. You said it yourself and you have a front row seat to this show, your WH has made some important changes. If I had to guess, did either you or your H ever think in a million years that a set of circumstances like this would present themselves to you? There is a level of shame about the affair that can still persist and I think you are right that your WH was confronted with a dose of it when his friend and this property came up. I've reached a point in my recovery that I own my EA and what damage I caused to my marriage and family, but it also isn't something I broadcast out to the public, so I'm sitting here asking myself if I would've been forthright with the builder or used a more generic line about how it is a family matter and we will discuss it (which is kind of where I lean). I think it also depends on the level of friendship. My closest friends know the dirty details of my A and my wife's A and others who only know that we were going through some shit a few yeas ago. It is all context and situation based, but I can't say that there are days when I want to go into the long explanation, even with a more casual friend. That last part is totally subjective, as only you and your H know the level of closeness you guys have with the builder.

I think the more important thing is that your H put you and his marriage first in this situation. He came to you as a partner and told you something that was hard to share with you and he seemingly had no issue coming to you with it, which is something you said in the past he wouldn't have done. We are never finished growing and learning, so this can be an instructive moment for both of you and a chance for you to bond. My suggestion is that you sit down and detail to him what upset you about this interaction and how you feel like his comment about "nothing happened" was dismissive of the pain and hurt that you experienced as a BS. I keep coming back to "walls" and "windows" from Not Just Friends and I do feel strongly that sometimes there are reasons to put up walls to protect your marriage and this may be one of those times where your WH's heart was in the right place but his actions were suboptimal when it came to putting up a wall. I'm confident that if your WH has come as far as he seems to have (again based on your comments) that if you sit down to discuss this with him in an honest, open and non-accusatory way, you may be surprised to see the empathy and response you get.

Bor9455

Thank you! I needed this perspective. I know he doesn’t want to broadcast it. Truth is I DO have a problem with it.

He did apologize profusely. And took the possibility of the deal off the table when he saw how I felt about it.

Just "nothing happened" triggered the bejeezus out of me.

He said he had the conversation at dinner because it seemed like we were really in a good place-we were-and he didn’t want to sit on it too long without telling me. Which is good.

I think your WH is in about the same place as mine. IDK if you have seen some of my posts but WH has been in IC for over 3 years now, and the changes you describe as similar to the changes I see as huge progress with my WH. I can also see my WH doing something similar to what you described - the whole shebang.

Just "nothing happened" triggered the bejeezus out of me.

The nothing happened triggered you, because it was a lie, for the benefit of your WH, both to minimize the A to someone else, and to make the conversation between he and builder-friend move on quickly. You are completely justified in feeling irritated about that. I would too. You also are in a good enough place that you can call your WH out about it AND he reacted like this:

He said he had the conversation at dinner because it seemed like we were really in a good place-we were-and he didn’t want to sit on it too long without telling me. Which is good.

This reaction IS good. If your WH is like mine, mine would have: 1) thought that his conversation with builder-friend WAS what I would have wanted him to do (i.e. telling him the property might be a no-go because of the family involved and my discomfort with it), 2) would not have even thought that what he said made ME sound like some unreasonably jealous person or put me in a bad light in any way. In the past, when called out my WH would have reacted defensively - and it could have been a huge blow out. I think ultimately we would end up where you and he did - which is a massive improvement. In other words, I think you all are doing all right in the process.

Granted, I am left a little ill at ease about saying he confessed to the builder-friend about the actuality of the A (even cliff note version is fine - actually dude, I DID have an A with seller's daughter and my wife found out and we have been working through it, so while the property seems to be a good deal, for obvious reasons, she and I are going to pass on it) but didn't really. I can get not wanting to broadcast it to everyone - if I'm being honest in his shoes I wouldn't either. So that's what you have to work on now I think.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 7:51 PM, Wednesday, August 23rd]

Thank you! I needed this perspective. I know he doesn’t want to broadcast it. Truth is I DO have a problem with it.

He did apologize profusely. And took the possibility of the deal off the table when he saw how I felt about it.

Just "nothing happened" triggered the bejeezus out of me.

He said he had the conversation at dinner because it seemed like we were really in a good place-we were-and he didn’t want to sit on it too long without telling me. Which is good.

If it was helpful, I'm glad to be of service. I don't know if my perspective/explanation has any real basis in truth and facts, but I do tend to look for the good intentions in people and at the very least the way you described things felt to me like your husband's actions were in the right place but to be sure he most definitely didn't stick the landing.

While I understand the comment that this was a romantic time out for the two of you and he shouldn't have brought it up, a generous reading of that could be that he was feeling closer to you and safe to share something that had been gnawing at him a bit. I mean, I have the benefit of not being in your relationship, but if I look at it from the outside, your FWH knows that this potential deal with the AP's family could be a very triggering situation that if wasn't addressed could create a space/resentment between you two. Your FWH in an attempt to nip that in the ass before it became something more brought it up to you. We always say around here, look at their actions and not their words. In this case, I think we need to emphasize that, his words sucked (he didn't stick the landing) but his actions reveal his intentions, he wanted to bring this to you. I think this was a setback in some ways to be sure, but it also is a moment where maybe my oft used "not sticking the landing" has you questioning whether or not you can let your guard down and trust this man not to hurt you again, which is a very valid concern after infidelity.

Look, I will say what came to mind on this and you can take the thought and leave it or run with it. Infidelity sucks-diddly-ucks and I think all of us here on SI know that in spades. One thing that the two of you probably have not covered, I'm inferring that based on this event, but if you have ignore me is a messaging strategy. This an opportunity for the two of you to come together, as a team and decide what level of communication you are comfortable with when it comes to close friends, friends acquaintances, close family, third cousins on down the line. You could even write down different tiers of messages that you want to tell, because at the end of the day, this is only your business, but coming up with "the company line" will make it easier for both of you to address these things that will come up. I get that it stinks that you never thought when you were standing at the altar, one day you are going to sit down with this man you love and figure out how to message his affair to your closest friends and family, and believe me, if this is too much for you and too much hard work as your original post alluded to, then by all means better to recognize that now and cut your losses than to trudge forward knowing it is too much for you. On the upside, sitting down and doing this together is a chance for some intimacy and closeness to be built in your new post infidelity relationship.

If you haven't already done a post mortem on the conversation from dinner the other night, you can find a way to pull him aside and talk to him about what did and didn't work for you and how you can approach these things as a team. I personally think that would go a long ways towards your FWH's confidence, because in a number of ways he did the right thing in defending your relationship, something you want to encourage him to keep doing and his journey as a WH is tough work and yes, people may think that they don't need encouragement and reinforcement, but he's only human. I guess what I'm also trying to say is that in the aftermath of infidelity, R can sometimes feel like a war of attrition and sometimes it is best that one side calls for a ceasefire and maybe a different solution can be worked out. Obviously I don't know the whole situation of your R and your relationship, but maybe this is one of those times where you give yourselves some grace to try a more diplomatic approach.

That is an excellent idea. We had a game plan for almost everything....how to deal with triggers, what we'll do when we inevitably run into the others, etc. Thank you again!

We did post mortem....and I did express appreciation for prioritizing my feelings and our marriage above the deal that we'd obviously benefit from in other ways. Took me a few days to process enough to get there. He did say my piece of mind was more important.

I'll admit, it took the wind out of my sails for a few days. What was most disturbing to me was the "nothing happened" that was first thrown out there. With me, when I'm in those dark places, he owns it. But the builder is a friend and work partner. I didn't appreciate being made off like the unnecessarily crazy/jealous wife. But, on the other hand.....he DID tell me that is what he said, rather than fib about that. He's very good with actions, but more human with sticking the landing.

Thanks again!

What was most disturbing to me was the "nothing happened" that was first thrown out there. With me, when I'm in those dark places, he owns it. But the builder is a friend and work partner. I didn't appreciate being made off like the unnecessarily crazy/jealous wife. But, on the other hand.....he DID tell me that is what he said, rather than fib about that. He's very good with actions, but more human with sticking the landing.

Once again I'm glad I can be of any help.

I get that the "nothing happened" really stings. Could your husband clear the air with the builder? Don't know how close you guys are, but could you guys invite the builder's family over for dinner/ BBQ and your husband and come clean to them about what happened in the appropriate level of detail? You don't want to dwell on this too long and maybe a FaceTime call would suffice, but if you WH is as committed as he seems to be, I would think him willing to swallow this part of the shit sandwich wouldn't be so bad. Just a thought, since this has really seemed to strike a chord with you, obviously the "nothing happened" bell cannot be un-rung, but your WH can work to repair the image you two project to the builder.

I mean, I think about the adage we have here, a WS ruins a lot of things in a marriage and the ones who are worthy of R are the ones who are willing to crawl across burning hot coals and broken glass shards to win back their BS...in this instance a couple of beers and some burgers would be all that was needed for him to come clean to the builder about why the deal would be great if not for your WH's affair with AP. I will tell one thing, when I was finally ready and came clean with some work colleagues about my and my wife's infidelities, the reception as nothing like I had imagined. A lot of people have been touched by this awful thing in their lives and I'm sure the builder will understand and if the builder is actually a friend, he will show that understanding and compassion too. Sure, his perception of your WH and maybe you will be changed forever, but if he is a friend, you would rather his perception of you two be framed by the absolute truth.

I am wondering how you guys decided together who should be told and who should not be told. It sounds like you like to err on the side of him being straightforward and honest with people about his cheating. I admire that you are so open about it. From your post it did not sound like the builder was a CLOSE friend, but maybe I have that wrong. I would just love to hear your thought process around these things because I find it pretty confusing. My husband’s cheating was at work with his secretary so maybe it makes sense that we would be more reticent about it. We socialize a lot with all these people and there are varying degrees of who knows what. I find it very confusing to sort out.

It sounds like your husband defers to you on who you would like to have know. At least I hope so, and it sounds like it from your post. My husband defers to my wishes on this as well. But even with that understanding (that it is my choice) I still have trouble deciding what I want said about it to others. I had always assumed that most people went with the « only close friends » approach. Because of our circumstances — and the fact that I showed up at his office and blew it all up to high heaven — far more people know than « close friends ».

Just wondering how you sorted all this out in your process of recovery. Regardless of that, if your husband knew you would prefer him to be honest and he chose not to do that I can see how that would hurt. It sounds like he flubbed it but is sorry.

I’d definitely have a problem with the combination of "Nothing happened," with "my wife wouldn’t like it," because it does actually both make him look innocent and then make you look like a jealous/unreasonable wife. The unsaid is that HE wouldn’t have a problem with it but YOU would because he "used to work out with her." It’s likely that he didn’t have time to think all of that through very well, but it would definitely be worth a conversation to me to point out that this is precisely what he did during the A: blame me for anything he didn’t want to own (speaking of my own WH here) and make me look like the bad guy.

It might be worth it to have a conversation about how this could have been handled differently. After all, it wasn’t really necessary for him to say anything at all about it except, I’d really need to talk to LBM about something like that. I’ll bring it up to her and see what she thinks. That would happen in any relationship where a major transaction is being considered. So if the idea is that the two of you don’t want or need to disclose to the world, great. It’s not everyone’s business. But he definitely put a question mark in his colleagues mind with the way that he put it. Going over how the two of you want to handle it in the future would probably be helpful.

I never held back on who knew. It’s the worst kept secret in town. People do go through horrible things in life. I’ve generally seen more compassion and empathy than anything else. I’m one of those people who…..I might keep my mouth shut about something, but you can read the subtitles all over my face. I couldn’t hide it. Plus, I lost so much weight so quickly that many people who know me thought I had cancer.

FWH said that he told the builder that we wouldn’t be involved in the deal. That he had been "inappropriate" with the OW. Or at least that is what he told me. Builder has moved on. We’re looking at another piece of land.

Oh….and OW showed up on the swim last night, stood 6 inches from me, when I moved…followed me. And, the when I went to retrieve my shoes from the dock, found that she had placed her bag on top of them while chatting with someone else. All very innocent to anyone who doesn’t know. I feel like I need to blow that up.

I don’t know how long you’ve been in recovery, but I’m at 2-1/2 years "very slow" recovery with a wife who wants to rugsweep but is showing glacial progress (but still progress none the less). I’m currently still at the point that I will not visit with her any place that her and affair partner ever went to. That is currently my line in the sand. For me "A good business opportunity" is not worth the feelings from triggering, at least not yet. Make the choice that best serves your future and mental well being. Good luck in whatever you choose.

[This message edited by Copingmybest at 2:31 PM, Thursday, August 24th]

I hear you. The best I can describe it....as a double betrayal in a smaller community. I think the level of running into the others could only be worse if I related to them by blood. It's literally as if he had an a with my sister or something. While we 4 1/2 years down the road and generally in a well done through the road of recovery.....when these bigger ones hit, I become keenly aware of how much work we done....and how much easier it would have been for me to just have left. This is HARD work.

I hear you. The best I can describe it....as a double betrayal in a smaller community. I think the level of running into the others could only be worse if I related to them by blood. It's literally as if he had an a with my sister or something. While we 4 1/2 years down the road and generally in a well done through the road of recovery.....when these bigger ones hit, I become keenly aware of how much work we done....and how much easier it would have been for me to just have left. This is HARD work.

What you described is rough. I grew up in a small town (about 8,000 people) and my mom always had her ear to the ground on things like that, since it was also the same town she grew up in, so she knew practically everyone in all the houses around town. For my family and I, it wasn't really by design that we moved out of state (my job was there) and it turns out that we live in a large metro area where we have a level of relative anonymity. Literally no one that any of us run into during our day to day knows about what my wife and I have gone through unless we specifically told them. I'm grateful that her AP lived out of state and only traveled here to visit his family and yeah he knew where we lived, we've since moved and it would be pretty unlikely to ever have a chance encounter with him or run into him at the gym. If I ever did see him at my gym and he was within 6 inches of me like your WH's AP was just the other day...let's just say that you were the bigger person than I was.

Honestly, I'm trying to work up to being more powerful. But, my body reacts like she's the tiger in the room. And, I'm just trying to hold it together. It's a triathlon community. And, the races/workouts....this physically demanding part of this....is SO much easier than the run ins.

Honestly, I'm trying to work up to being more powerful. But, my body reacts like she's the tiger in the room. And, I'm just trying to hold it together. It's a triathlon community. And, the races/workouts....this physically demanding part of this....is SO much easier than the run ins.

There are things I am and things I am not and at 6'2" and 260 lbs, I am not and have never been a triathlete type. I was athletic enough to play college football and compete in the shot put at a collegiate level, but I am not compatible with long distance running at any level. That being said, I'm not even sure I'm a monathlete these days, so major kudos and props to you for kicking ass on something that is grueling.

Why does she have have to be in the same group as you, is it a function of the small town thing?

Definitely a function of the smaller city AND small community in the tri-world. Town is so small that if I don’t run into her during workouts….it’s at the grocery store.

It’s like being on a cruise ship with your ex. You’ll always run into them. But instead of 5000 people, it’s closer to 100. And, instead of 6 degrees of separation, our town is closer to 2.

OW showed up on the swim last night, stood 6 inches from me, when I moved…followed me. And, the when I went to retrieve my shoes from the dock, found that she had placed her bag on top of them while chatting with someone else. All very innocent to anyone who doesn’t know. I feel like I need to blow that up.

Please blow that up.

I've been following your threads and she's mean-girling you for sure. You are reading her correctly.

You have nothing to be ashamed of, she does. She's just too entitled to allow herself to feel it.

You can't make her feel shame, but you can make her nervous.

Stare right at her, but don't say anything--even if she talks to you. Just stare. At most, stare and end with a "Huh" as you walk away--like you assessed her and found her lacking.

If she wants to get into your bubble spacially, pretend not to notice and step back or sideways into her--foot, elbow, both, whatever. Keep repeating as necessary. Let her know that you will bodycheck her. Do not apologize for the bodycheck. Just look right through her and walk away.

That purse on your shoes thing? Grab your shoes with enough force to roll that purse upside down.

Nonverbally or verbally blow that up.

Do you have a friend that would wingman you through these encounters when they happen in the triathlete realm? If I had a friend in your shoes, I'd be volunteering to help bodycheck, or stare,
or run interference ...and I'm a really mild person.

I’m a fairly mild manner person too….clearly. Unsurprisingly, when my husband or her boyfriend attends, she keeps her distance big time. There are plenty who now know. I’m just getting to the point where I’m telling more people, enlisting friends to help keep us out of smaller groups together. It’s too much right now.

[This message edited by Ladybugmaam at 5:49 PM, Sunday, August 27th]