SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

First ever post and looking for some advice. My wife and I have been married 36 years now. My wife had an affair 27 years ago. At the time, I suspected something was going on. Late night phone calls when I was in bed. Calls deleted from the caller ID and lack of affection. She had played volleyball for two seasons while I stayed home and watched our children. After volleyball, the teams would go to a local pizza joint (Salerno’s) for a couple of beers and hang out. On Sept 22, 1998 – I decided to find out if she was at Salerno’s. So I drove to Salerno’s and she wasn’t there. I waited for her to come home. She came home around 1100 PM and asked her how volleyball was and where she went afterwords. She responded that they had lost a bunch of games and they all went to Salerno’s for few beers. Interesting enough, I could not detect the smell of alcohol on her breath. I said, are you sure you went to Salerno’s? She said yes. I then told her that I went to Salerno’s and did not see her car, went inside and she wasn’t there. Her car was also not at the High School where they played volleyball. She then said that she met a guy who played volleyball in the league after the game and all they did was talk in the car while parked at a local middle school. This didn’t make sense to me as I had suspected something more been going on for much longer, as in an affair. She insisted that this was their first meeting, and "nothing sexual had happened". I pushed further and got nowhere; she was steadfast in her story. I was angry, so I asked her for his name and phone number. I called his house and he answered, I told him I knew where they had been and asked to speak to his wife. I told her that her husband was not at Salerno’s, but instead was parked in a school parking lot with my wife. I also told her about my suspicions about the affair.

My wife cried and told me absolutely nothing had happened. I told her she cannot call him anymore, if she did, I was gone. The next day, I called him and asked him to meet me at a local gas station – I had planned to physically attack him. He met me and I told him I knew about the affair, and he wins, he can have her. He stated that all she did was talk about me. I should have asked about the details, but I didn’t. I again said, you can have her. Otherwise, this stops right here and now, you better not see or call her ever again. I later found out that he did call the next day to tell her what his wife said. I let that slide.

The next day, after work, I added tape recorder to our line and recorded a conversation that occurred the following day between her and one of her female friends on the team. I will mention that this friend has an open marriage. She went into details about what had happened. Again, I questioned her, and she was adamant that "nothing sexual had happened". I had planned to stay married until our children were independent and managed to push this far back in my memory.

However, I can’t take it anymore. I think about this everyday because I want the truth. I need to know why she would do something like this and how many times they saw each other. I have brought this up many times over the years and she still stuck by "nothing sexual happened". Fast forward to a few weeks ago, thinking about this all the time and wanting the truth. I used a voice to text application and have a transcription of the phone call between her and her open marriage friend. Here are the devastating parts: She said "that this had been going on for about two months and how do people do this for, like, a year. What the hell did I do wrong? ……. It wasn’t all sex or that kind of thing, so whatever, I got out of it". She also stated "I don't know. She just took all of my compliments and that person’s and said, 'Oh, gee, what the hell? You know, why not have two? ……. Yeah, but even so, I mean, you guys are kind of a good way. You know, you'll be allowed to have that." Implying that her friend would be lucky cause in an open marriage you can see other people. Even more devastating she said "Even though we'd be together numerous times. And like I was saying, you know, or whatever, I wasn't. And that was something that really bothered me. But not really." Worse for me, I could not detect any remorse, in fact, she was laughing and chuckling.

I showed it to my wife and again asked about the details as what she was telling me didn’t match what she had said on the phone. She finally admitted to giving OS at the local middle school and that was it. I patiently waited for a couple weeks and confronted her again. I showed her the phone call transcription where she stated they had been together numerous times. I again asked her to explain. She finally said that she had seen him privately four times in the two months that this had been going on. The first time, she gave him OS in my garage while I was at work. The next time he insisted on stopping by to see her in the parking lot while she was picking up a pizza for our family. She said he wanted to kiss her, but she felt uncomfortable doing that in the open. The third time they met at a local park while I was at work, and they had SI. She said she felt uncomfortable as she could hear people walking by, so she stopped. Salerno’s was the fourth time. She claims it was only four times, but I believe it was more.

I feel like I have been living a lie for 27 years. And finally, her admitting to having sex, makes my suspicions correct. The problem is I don’t believe I have the entire story. An affair for over two months and only seeing him four times doesn’t make sense. Two months and only one time having SI doesn’t fit. We have had a good life together over the years but.... I wouldn't have chosen the life we've had if I’d have known the details at the beginning, she has tarnished every memory we have together. She does seem genuinely remorseful over it unlike her tone in the phone call. But how can I go on if I don’t trust or believe her? I've been at my lowest point ever over this and hate thinking about it every day. I love her but I hate her for what she did. Will I ever get over this or is it time to go?... I'm heartbroken and lost.

[This message edited by DevastatedGT at 4:25 AM, Friday, January 24th]

It's literally been almost three decades and she's still going to only give you what she thinks that you know. She is not remorseful and if you can tell by the tone of her voice on the calls, she doesn't respect you either.

You need to speak with a lawyer. You need to move her out of the master bedroom. You need to get in touch with that loser's wife.

" We have had a good life together over the years"

That’s more than a lot can say.

Is she lying about how many times they had intercourse? Maybe. But if it was 10 times rather than once, does it really change anything? Why is she lying? Because she’s ashamed? Because she’s afraid you’ll leave her? Because she doesn’t want to hurt you more? All decent reasons.

You knew then that there was more to this, but chose to suck it up.

I wonder if you’re looking for a reason to leave, now.

And so be it. But make sure you’re honest with yourself, so you don’t make a mistake.

[This message edited by Formerpeopleperson at 1:46 AM, Friday, January 24th]

Sharkman is 100% correct on everything (your wife will only admit to what she thinks you already know, and that the person you heard on phone call is the real her, not the person crying crocodile tears to your face).

However, none of this is breaking news to you.

Although you say you would've done things differently if you had known everything from the start, the reality is that you always knew that she was having a full-blown sexual relationship with OM, but you stayed married for the sake of your children.

I assume, based on the length of your marriage, that your kids are already adults or close to it. So why are you continuing to live a lie? What makes you think you have any reasonable hope of full disclosure after 3 decades of lies? And if she did finally fess up to the whole truth after all this time, what would you do?

If you need a reason to end your marriage, you already have more than enough evidence on hand to justify that decision. Hell, most of the people whose spouses are cheating never get a smoking gun like those phone recordings and have to piece together a huge puzzle with much less.

But if what you want is for your wife to help you make sense of your life together and demonstrate genuine remorse, then you're setting yourself up for disappointment. Your wife treasures her dirty secrets more than she values your heart and your sanity.

If you want the rest of the truth have her write out a timeline for her affair that includes any other inappropriate behavior since you’ve been a couple. Then tell her it will be verified by polygraph and ask her if she needs to add anything to it. Even if you get further details follow through with the poly.

[This message edited by asc1226 at 5:12 PM, Friday, January 24th]

Welcome to SI and sorry you're joining us. There are some pinned posts at the top of the page plus some with bull's eye icons that we encourage new members to read. The Healing Library has a lot of great information, too. There's a thread in the ICR (I Can Relate) forum for those who found out long ago.

Will I ever get over this or is it time to go?

Have you tried IC (individual counseling)? I found working with a betrayal trauma specialist very helpful. Some do EMDR that may help you process through the trauma. You should be kind to yourself and try to process the hurt and anger, regardless of whether you stay or go.

Only you will know if you should stay or go because you know your situation the best.

But I agree with you. What she says doesn't make sense. I stopped trying to make sense out of it because it's trying to apply logic to an illogical situation.

Thank you for all the responses. After a two year battle, we recently lost our oldest Daughter to cancer. Dealing with the A and losing our daughter added to the emotional battle I've been dealing with. Guess it put me over the edge to be able to confront her again and get answers to questions I've had over the years. Knowing my WS had an affair and losing a Daughter is more devastation that most people have to deal with. The amount of pain I have is almost unbearable.

[This message edited by DevastatedGT at 4:01 PM, Friday, January 24th]

So sorry to hear about your daughter.

Can’t imagine that pain; lots of marriages don’t survive the loss of a child.

I don’t think you should make any major life decisions right now; wait until you’re in a better head space.

Try to stay busy.

First of all, my condolences on the loss of your daughter. There are few things more crushing than losing a child. I am sorry.

You have a hard choice to make. As others have said, you already have plenty of information concerning her marital treason that justifies cutting legal ties with her whether you find out anything further or not. Full stop.

But, I have a feeling that's not tbe heart of tbe matter for you. I think youre weary of it all. Tired to the bone of wrangling with the facts of the betrayal and that she chose to put you in this position. That you honestly think that you can no longer choke down being put in this position and through her "trickle truthing" is continuing to put you there.

Can you keep doing this? Do you want to?

As one who regrets the 10 years I put into that effort, regretting it deeply and moved on, my counsel is that life is too short to exist that way.

Devastated, I'm so sorry you're going through this. I have a similar situation with my wife of 38 years but I have no details. In fact, over the years, her story has been cleaned up a lot. My situation is dissimilar in that I knew going in that she had problems with drugs and promiscuity but I'm certain that these things have changed and I know that she's been a wonderful, loving, faithful companion for 35 years. Yet I'm haunted by what may or may not have happened in those first three years.

I don't want to leave her and wouldn't if she told me the truth. She's clinging to: "I don't remember what happened and when, way back then." I can't believe that she doesn't remember getting naked with or meeting a man to give OS in his car, and when it ended. Originally, it was "used meth every day for four months or so, traded sex for those drugs when short on cash." Now it's just one time. He was a co-worker but worked on a different team, both were field service people who worked unsupervised. I also did that job when I left the Navy, I know that you could disappear for half a day back then and that would go unnoticed. Meeting with another tech was also pretty normal and she says that's how she got her drugs on the regular. He got fired but she "can't remember when." This supposedly ended when we got together but she also says that she remembers doing the last of her stuff in my apartment, just can't remember if it was before or after she moved in. It's very possible that this continued for the 2 1/2 years that she worked that job, while I was still in the Navy. It's even possible that it continued after I went to work with that company. I may have been a co-worker with that guy as well, unaware. It's also possible that it did end before we got together, I just can't know and she's my only information source. That information has changed over the years as has her description of other salacious behavior that absolutely predates me, but that she told me about back then. Stuff like "gave OS to guys on the flight line." She was a Naval Air Reservist as well. Now it's one guy one time. Like being trickle truthed backwards. It's the attempting to clean it up, which are lies, that has me doubting other things. In that way and the long time spans here, are where if find similarity with you.

Again, so sorry for your situation.

@ ProbablyStupid

I'm sorry that you still don't have the entire story. If you're like me, having the entire story and a rough timeline of what happened is invaluable to allow forgiveness and healing. I didn't expect my WS to remember every detail of what happened but do expect her to remember the number of times they were together privately and the order of occurrence. Having stayed in the marriage so long, it would be difficult and painful to unwind the marriage and go our separate ways, even more so since we are dealing with the loss of our Daughter. I asked her to listen to several YouTube sessions hosted by Samuel from AffairRecovery so she could understand my feelings and what I've been going through not having the complete story and dealing with trickle truth. Moving forward, I asked her to write down a rough timeline of the events as best she could remember. I also promised I would not make any hasty decisions and would not vent any anger towards her. Several additional details were written down that I did not know. I also stated that this would be verified via a polygraph.

I now have a series of events and timeline that makes sense and will finally allow me to begin the recovery process and heal. All along she has admitted this was a terrible mistake and not worth losing our marriage. My response was, at the time it must have been worth it because you did this to us. I will also mention that she has been completely faithful for the past 27 years and we enjoy the time we spend together.

I pray that you find out the details you need to begin the recovery process.

I'm sorry that I neglected to mention the loss of your daughter. Such a devastating event. I pray that you find peace with that.

It's an odd sensation for me. Our marriage is now, probably the best it's ever been and yet, my questions remain. She's aware that I will not leave, yet she continues to clean up the story. I don't understand that at all.

I am so sorry for your pain.

I had a similar story—not as long but the same idea. Ten years ago a woman asked to become my WH’s secretary. She was vastly overqualified which should have been a red flag. One day he invited her on our boat. It was broad daylight, at our club, our kids were there, and he had invited his last older secretary on the boat once so I didn’t freak out as much as I should have. I told him to fire her, which he agreed to and she was completely gone within a few months. In the immediate aftermath he said she had tried to kiss him in the office but he said no.

How I could possibly have gone along with that story i don’t know. I asked about it several times a week, every week, for 8 years. Always the same story. Then 2 years ago he comes out with this big admission that it had been PA. I’ll spare the details. But I wanted to tell you my story to share the one thing that shocked me the most:

…even though in some senses "i knew" all those years. I was upset but it was manageable. When I found out the truth 8 years later I could not believe the level of pain. I still can’t believe it. I am amazed to have survived. I also had a concomitant trauma which made the situation worse. I am so sorry you have been going through so much pain. It is shocking to me that it could be so painful (even though I obviously realized cheating was a bad and hurtful thing). But, this is pain that levels you and puts you on the floor.

I crawled out of that hole. Two and a half years later I am greatly improved. I feel okay. They pain comes and goes but its less than once a week and when it comes it is a tiny fraction of what it was.

Although I am greatly improved, my marriage is only somewhat improved. Maybe it will get better. We’ll see. But, frankly, my only desperate need was to get MYSELF out of that hole.

I wish you healing and repair. I’m sure you’ve heard to engage in self-care, self-improvement, reflection, building a separate life yourself, creating personal goals and dreams that don’t involve your partner. I am somewhat convinced this is the only way. Good luck with all you are dealing with.