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He said it started off as BDSM but then got darker and more twisted and they would try and shock each other.

What you've described sounds really scary and it's no wonder folks have got their hackles raised on your behalf. It does kind of sound like you're on to something here though. What you've described sounds like a BDSM fantasy on steroids with no safe words. Taken together with your WH's covert resentments and the OW's need to "compete" with the BW (which is so typical among OWs), it could be an explanation for how this got started. There's still the question of where your WH's ethics and boundaries have gotten off to and what kind of flaw in his character allowed him to carry on like this.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:25 AM, Tuesday, October 24th]

One of the biggest challenges a betrayed faces after Dday is taking the focus off the cheater. It makes sense. We are totally confused and lost about who this person is so we study, obsess, try to figure it all out.

But that means the focus isn't on you and your daughter. YOU are the victim, not him. He's the perpetrator. And while you will, over time, need to accept who he really is and what he's done, that will take a long time. Meanwhile, you need to be focusing on you and your own healing.

He has refused to get help. He has tired of you bringing it up (already? wtf??). He's trying to manipulate you by appealing to your loving self. None of that helps you. In fact, it's heartless. While he's in this victim mindset he can only do more damage to you.

I'd advise you to start limiting contact. Let him know that you expect him to get himself some help and until he does that, there really isn't much to say. There is nothing you can do for him. You still expect him to fulfill his obligations as he agreed to and you reserve the right to ask any and all questions when you need them but he needs to figure his shit out and if he isn't going to do it with a professional, you have ZERO faith he will accomplish anything.

Get yourself a therapist. Start reading up on healing and taking care of yourself. See an attorney to know your rights.

[This message edited by TheEnd at 1:10 PM, Tuesday, October 24th]

I just want to say this is truly horrific and in reading through your story, he is honestly sounding like he is a dangerous psychopath. Who really knows what he is capable of. For your sake and the sake of your daughter, PLEASE file a police report and see an attorney NOW!! Both you and your daughter’s lives could be in jeopardy, and I don’t think I’m exaggerating.

This was hard to read. I’m so sorry for your experience. I know your head is probably spinning as you try to make sense of it all. Give yourself time to process. It will take time. A lot of time probably. You are going to be in for a ride with emotions changing by the minute.

What would you tell a friend if she came to you with a situation like yours? I know it’s hard to hear some of the advice and have your husband called a monster, etc. Of course we don’t know you or him but looking at it from the outside, it is disturbing- we all want you to be safe and get "out of infidelity" as they say around here.

I understand we may all have a dark or sick intrusive thought at times that we shush away, but to carry on in this manner over time and regarding a loved one. It’s hard to comprehend. Please take care of yourself.

You have said,repeatedly, you know he would never physically hurt you. You know he wouldn't harm you.

Gently..did you know he was fantasizing,with real women,about raping you? Did you know about the other dozens of women? No. He was doing it for a decade.

This is a man who is very,very comfortable with lying and manipulating you. You know who he wanted you to think he was. You don't know him.

He is not appalled by his actions. He is not in shock. He is not traumatized. He has known,all along, exactly what he was doing.

He has turned the aftermath of dday into a pity party for him. Stop participating.

You absolutely need to go to the police. You absolutely need to inform her husband.

He is only ashamed that you know. He is not ashamed of what he did. He got off on it.

He contradicts himself,at every turn.

He knows this sick woman wouldn't try to harm you. Yet, he admits she's very sick. He says he didn't think of it as cheating, yet called them his mistresses.

Go no contact with him. The kids are old enough,he can contact them directly. His relationship with them is his to repair. Not you. He has absolutely betrayed the kids as well. They are allowed to feel angry,and shouldn't be told to forgive him,or even speak to him right now. That's his to deal with. Get some distance from him. It will help you see clearly, and will allow you to detach a bit.

This is beyond infidelity. Most cheaters don't fantasize about hurting their BS. Honestly, the fact that you are hurting is probably enticing to him. His "pain" is because he has had consequences, and he's worried you will tell people the truth.

It's about him. Not you. If it were about you,he would be moving mountains. He wouldn't have needed you to suggest IC. He would have already made an appointment. He would be volunteering information. He wouldn't be making this all about him.

He's sorry he got caught. That is not,in any way, close to shame and remorse.

[This message edited by HellFire at 8:51 PM, Tuesday, October 24th]

"I am going to threadjack. Funhouse, when you were on the phone with these men did they talk about harming their wives? I thought men fantasized about other women, or men, but not to harm their SO."

These were almost always sexual fantasies. They might talk about being with "me" in front of their wives or the three of us together. Most who fantasized about rape either wanted to do it to the character I played (an 18-20 year old) or wanted it forced on them. (the men.) So my answer is no, with the caveat that if you can imagine it, someone has gotten off to it.

I know I should cut him off but it’s so hard to do as he is the only person who knows about this in real life and the only person who can possibly help me make sense of it and why he did it. Part of me still loves him and the other part of me despises him and I keep swinging between the two.

He is only ashamed that you know. He is not ashamed of what he did. He got off on it.

I said this to him and his response was that he was ashamed at the time and it was a shameful dirty secret that he couldn’t stop. He says he wanted to stop and would sometimes delete the app but then temptation would come and he’d reinstall it and get sucked back into it. I told him that if he hadn’t been caught he’d still be doing it now and he said he likes to think he wouldn’t as he was planning on stopping. I think that’s wishful thinking, like when gamblers say they’re going to just have one more bet. I asked him what he thought would happen when he eventually got caught, how did he think this was ever going to end? He says he never thought it would happen because he always planned to end it. He never thought about the repercussions.

The sick woman who shared all these fantasies with my WS isn’t married so I can’t tell her husband. My WS told me she has another online lover that he knows of who is also married. I messaged her lover to clarify if he was her partner (but didn’t tell him anything) and he’s deleted his entire profile and blocked me. I’m wondering if she’s doing the same thing with him and he’s scared I’m going to tell his wife.

I went to my first session of IC and they told me it is psychological abuse. They are going to see how they can support me but have referred me to a charity that deals with sexual violence against women for advice. I keep having flashbacks to what he said and the messages I read. They wake me up in the night and I just lie there paralysed with fear and feeling like I’m dying inside.

[This message edited by Brokenandscared1 at 12:07 PM, Wednesday, October 25th]

Please tell a trusted friend,or family member. You need someone else to go to for support.

He is talking out of both sides of his mouth. He's tried to stop,but always went back because he missed her. Yet, had you not caught him, he'd thinks he would have ended it already.

Don't believe anything he tells you about her. He's protective of her. Him telling you he knows her well enough to know you aren't on danger, indicates this was also emotional. He seems to know a lot about a woman he claims he just shared sexual fantasies about.

It is psychological abuse and I am very, very happy to hear that you are seeking outside help. Lean into that and others you can trust. Lean far, far away from your husband for emotional support. He can answer questions, if that helps you, but take most of it with a grain of salt if you can. Otherwise, he is not the person you should lean on for support/healing. I know it's hard to do. Please do your best.

help me make sense of it and why he did it

It may take you awhile to understand this, but you won't be able to have what he did make any sense. You're trying to make sense (or apply logic) to an illogical situation. It won't make sense to you. It won't make sense to anybody with a rationale mind. What you can do is acknowledge that your WH has placed you inside the scene of a horror show. Truly, what you listened to must be horrific.

It's possible that you have PTSD from this. Please continue to seek help.

See your doctor for medication, if that's what you need. I was on anti-depressants and anti-anxiety meds for about a year after dday.

I am so sorry op at what you are going through.

One question that sprung into my mind is, although you have found the person he was messaging do you 100% know it was her in real life?

Scammers use other peoples images. Sometimes by having an EA with them and keeping the photos they receive - this means they cannot be reverse image searched, other times by stealing the pictures off their social media.

They can also steal moving images from online sources. It’s pretty scary tbh. I have seen several programmes on this and the lengths these people go to is incredible. I am not saying he was been scammed but are you sure the other party is the woman you think it is.

I can certainly see why someone with such sick fantasies would hide their real identity. Are you sure it’s a woman for example? Are you sure they are abroad?

Not trying to scare you but people lie including online people he feels he knows really well. He is living proof of the lengths people go to to lie to get what they want.

Please tell a trusted friend,or family member. You need someone else to go to for support.

There really isn’t anyone I could tell in real life about this. I would also worry about it getting back to my daughter at some point and it would destroy her to know what he’s said. It feels like a weight off of my shoulders to at least be able to talk about it on here. It felt like I was keeping a dirty secret and it’s his dirty secret not mine.

What would you tell a friend if she came to you with a situation like yours? I know it’s hard to hear some of the advice and have your husband called a monster, etc. Of course we don’t know you or him but looking at it from the outside, it is disturbing- we all want you to be safe and get "out of infidelity" as they say around here.

I would be horrified I’m sure and telling her to run. It’s very difficult for me as I have known this man for 23 years. Over half of my life. It’s so difficult for me to equate what I’ve heard and seen with the man I’ve loved for all these years and I believed had been a good husband to me.

It may take you awhile to understand this, but you won't be able to have what he did make any sense. You're trying to make sense (or apply logic) to an illogical situation. It won't make sense to you. It won't make sense to anybody with a rationale mind. What you can do is acknowledge that your WH has placed you inside the scene of a horror show. Truly, what you listened to must be horrific.

This has struck a chord with me and you’re right I may never be able to make sense of it. He can’t really make sense if it either. He has made an appointment for IC and is going to ask for a psychiatric assessment to see if there is something fundamentally wrong with him that has enabled him to detach himself from reality like this. He said to me the best way he can describe is that it’s like there are two rooms with a glass wall inbetween them. When he’s in the first room with me that is his normal life and he would never hurt me or cheat but when he goes into the other room it’s separate and make believe and he has this evil persona because it’s not real to him. I told him by giving her my photos he made it real and merged his two worlds and he can see that he’s done that. He said he wants to die because he cannot live with the guilt and shame of what he’s done to me. I’ve told him he’s an abuser and he said he knows he is and he wants to get help and try and do whatever he can to help me.

One question that sprung into my mind is, although you have found the person he was messaging do you 100% know it was her in real life?

Yes it was 100% her. As well as the photos and voice messages she has sent him many videos where she was sat talking into the camera in response to something he had said. In one if the videos she said she felt sad that their fantasies always had to involve me and sometimes she wished it could just be about her without me. He responded to this by telling her how much he loved her and how special she is to him. That was also very painful to hear and he says he meant it in the moment but outside of the app he felt nothing for her.

There were many other messages, videos and photos from other women too. I actually messaged quite a few of them on the app when I found out because I wanted to know what he’d said about me and whether or not he’d sent photos. A couple of them said they knew he was married he hadn’t gone into any further details and a couple of them told me he had told them of a bdsm/rape fantasy but they didn’t fantasise about it together with him as they weren’t into it. One of them told me he had sent her a photo of my face and I also saw a message to another woman sent very recently where he sent her a photo of me as an apology for something he had said. I asked him why he did this and he said she’s bisexual so he thought she might like it and he wanted to show me off. She didn’t respond so I am guessing she was not impressed.

Although he’s been doing this for 10 years it got much worse when it went from emails to this messaging app and he met this evil woman. He’s been on the app for 2.5 years but he’s only been sending the photos for the last 5 months. Sadly I only gave the intimate photos to him 5 months ago and as soon as he got them he sent them off within hours. Out of the 50 women I know of as far as I’m aware it’s three women he’s sent photos too and just this one sick woman who he has had this long term affair with for the last 2.5 years and has been sharing all these sick fantasies with. She seems to be the only one he had an emotional connection with. I have messaged her but she hasn’t replied and on her social media she is just carrying on like normal posting smiling happy photos which is just sickening to me considering what she’s done.

The same words you're calling her..sick, disrurbed,evil..absolutely apply to your husband. He was doing the same thing she was..except he took it even further, and sent her pics. Also, he is even more of those things you call her, the rape victim in their fantasies is you. You are no one to her. You are his wife.

If he can't figure out why he did this,he can't say he won't do it again.

You are correct in your assessment. This is sick. This is evil.

If your daughter is in your position some day..what would you want her to do. Why?

The same words you're calling her..sick, disrurbed,evil..absolutely apply to your husband. He was doing the same thing she was..except he took it even further, and sent her pics. Also, he is even more of those things you call her, the rape victim in their fantasies is you. You are no one to her. You are his wife.

Yes you’re right. He had a duty to protect me whereas she would have felt no loyalty towards me. Also from the messages it seems as though he was worse than her and he was the one driving most of it. I asked him this and he admitted it would be easy to try and place all the blame on her but he was probably the worse out of the two of them. I feel much more anger, disgust and betrayal towards my husband but I also feel like he is being punished as he’s lost everything whereas she has got away with it with no consequences.

I agree if he can’t figure out why he’s done this then there’s no guarantee he won’t do it again. I am trying to support him as I want him to be a better person and be there for our daughter in the future. He repulses me and I despise him for what he’s done but I can’t just cut contact with him as I’m not strong enough. However the thought of having him back makes me feel scared and I can’t do it. I hate him too much for what he’s done to me.

If this happened to my daughter I would advise her to have nothing to do with him, seek legal advice and contact the police. I am not that strong though.

Well,then,we need to work on that.

Detach. Read the 180,in the Healing Library. Practice it every day. Go NC with him, except kids and finances. This is necessary for you to detach. The more you detach, the stronger you will feel.

I have recently had a dday,after over a decade of reconciliation. I know how hard it is to do what I'm suggesting you do. I am trying to do the same. Sometimes I fail. And thats ok. This is hard. I've been married for about as long as you have.

180. Detach. Distance. You can do it. We both can.

Gently, figuring out why he does this is no guarantee he won't do it again.

He needs to change himself in order to not betray you again. He needs to change himself from betrayer into good partner.

And if he does, you still have the option of dumping him.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for R with a WS who looks like they're making the necessary change, if R is what both BS & WS want. But I'm all for D if the WS won't change fast enough for the BS and/or if the partners don't want to R.

But it's the change that's necessary, not just figuring out why the WS betrayed their partner.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 4:49 PM, Thursday, October 26th]

Detach. Read the 180,in the Healing Library. Practice it every day. Go NC with him, except kids and finances. This is necessary for you to detach. The more you detach, the stronger you will feel.

Thank you, you’re right. I will read the 180 and try and take it on board. I’m so thankful to have found this site.

Gently, figuring out why he does this is no guarantee he won't do it again

I know this, it’s just I feel I need to try and make sense of it. He keeps talking about how was able compartmentalise his life and I’ve been reading a lot about it. From what I’ve read this is how lot of WS are able to justify their affairs. By compartmentalising they are able to dissociate from it. Subconsciously he doesn’t connect his married self with his cheating self or with the man who was able to say such awful things. He really doesn’t see it as him. But you’re right he really does need to be able to change, and even if he does work on it and does change I still don’t know that I’ll ever be able to get past it or see him the same way again.

I don’t have much wisdom to add. You’ve gotten a lot of good input to sit with. But I’m so, so sorry you’re here. This is a gut wrenching level of trauma. Take care of yourself.

It will take time to clear your head and disentangle yourself from someone who’s been your partner over half your life, but you can absolutely take little steps to take care of yourself and focus on your wellbeing.

In addition to the horrifying things your husband did with this awful woman over 2.5 years, a smaller detail sticks out to me: he casually sent a private photo of you to "apologize" to a complete stranger.

That is an evil, psychopathic level of disregard for you and your safety. He’s using you as currency for a whole dark and dangerous other life. He’s not living that life by himself, which would be bad enough, he’s bringing you into it, using you as an object any chance he gets.

Getting your strength together to face this will be so hard. I don’t pretend to be able to muster that kind of strength, I feel like I’d crumple under that burden.

But we’re all stronger than we think we are. You will find that inner reserve. Here’s someone across the pond who is thinking of you and rooting for you as you claw your way out of this nightmare. Hang on, and take care.

No. He can't say he compartmentalized. Not when you were the victim in all of his sick fantasies ehen he talked,and messaged, with this woman. Not when he sent your pictures to these people.

Compartmentalizing is when a ws keeps his home life separated from his affair(s). When he's home,he's home. When he's with her, he puts the bs in a box, so to speak.

He can't say he did that, when he definitely brought you,and the marriage,into the fantasy.

It's an excuse. And a flimsy one.

Him saying this wasn't him,and he can't believe it was him is his way of not taking responsibility amd accountability.

It was him. It is him. For years.

He's not in shock. He's knows all along exactly what he was doing. He planned it around his time with you. And,I believe you said he messaged these people when he was with your daughter. He didn't respect her enough to not do that.